Intro

SPEAKER_01 0:00

This week we talk about two movies where things uh truly do not go according to plan.

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That's right. We're going from hmm killy killy as Jason Statham uncovers human trafficking while in a container ship in Mutiny to silly silly as four funny ladies have what looks like the most unrelaxing time in spa weekend.

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And for TV, we're heading back underground for Silo Season 3, Episode 8, Grey Goo. See. Before we head back up and take flight with lanterns, season one, episode 2, Trustfall.

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Hopefully all that goes as planned for us because this is We should watch that episode 2022.

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It's a nice double.

Movie Review: Mutiny

SPEAKER_04 1:10

Hold on to your butts, friends, because it's time for Mutiny, the new Jason Statham thriller from director Jean-Francois Rocher, who also made Plane, which we loved. And fun fact, they were actually developing a sequel to Plane called Ship. Yes, Plane was going to be followed by Ship. And apparently none of this is confirmed. It's all allegedly. It was supposed to follow Mike Coulter's character onto a cargo ship where he discovers human trafficking, which, if you've seen Mutiny, hmm, that sounds familiar. There have been reports that Mutiny grew out of the project, but who can say? So anyway, the setup is simple. In Mutiny, Jason Statham plays Cole, a former cop working private security who watches his surprisingly nice billionaire boss get murdered. He gets framed for it and ends up on a cargo ship, trying to clear his name while stumbling into a whole international conspiracy. So what did he think, Sush?

SPEAKER_01 2:17

Well, the first trailer sets up Statham's character a bit as a cop who worked with his dad investigating human trafficking operations before going right into a montage of him just tearing ass through a bunch of bad dudes. We got an edit of KRS1 step into a world represental light that's cut so it syncs with each of Statham's strikes.

SPEAKER_04 2:40

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:41

That continues through the trailer. So it's like I don't know, what more do I need? Even so, it's also established that this movie is from the director of playing, puts it right up on the screen for you. Which obviously, as you mentioned, was starring Gerard Butler and Mike Culture, which we loved. Yes. To me, that meant this was a safe bet as far as the action was concerned. It's almost like this trailer wants to really drive that point home because after a really quick introduction of a couple other characters, one of which we assume is the big bad of the movie, we return to another montage of action scenes escalating in intensity to close out. Is it one of Staums more complex characters? Absolutely not. But did it have some of the most intense bloody fight scenes we've seen him in lately? Absolutely, yeah. I mean, I didn't even really need the second trailer, it's basically a shorter cut. We also see the woman from the first trailer fighting off some bad guys with a knife. Overall, I don't know if it's because of the shorter length or because it really was intended to be. But we seem to get an even more violent trailer than the first. Regardless, given that Ashley and I are both huge Jason Statement fans, there really wasn't too much that would have kept us from seeing this. Oh yeah. Yeah. And also, there really wasn't much that they needed to do in order to get used. So now, having seen this movie, I definitely don't feel like I got a wildly different movie than expected. As I mentioned earlier, Jean-Francois Rocher, who also directed Plane, and I was surprised to discover also directed the 2005 Assault on Precix 13 remake with Ethan Hawke and Lawrence Fishburne also directed this. He's known for making movies with heroes that usually have some type of ex-military or law enforcement background, but have led either secretive and or morally questionable lives since that are the only ones apparently capable of dealing with the stopping or uncovering of some type of secret plot led by some corrupt government or corporate entity, typically taking place within confined settings.

SPEAKER_04 5:05

Oh man.

SPEAKER_01 5:06

That is literally what this movie is.

SPEAKER_04 5:08

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:09

And it's all set up in the trailer. Dude with a law enforcement background, disappeared for a bit, ends up uncovering some human trafficking plot that's taking place on this container ship. While I didn't think the writing nor direction were all that bad, I do think that it was very much a straightforward vehicle for Jason Statham's hand-to-hand and gunfight scenes. It very rarely tries to leverage Staton's other capabilities as a character. Since I've seen him convincingly play funny and sensitive or emotional roles or moments in other films, and just seems to focus on how single-minded he is, almost letting the audience decide whether the character is actually trying to do good and save those being traffic. That he's simply doing this out of, to quote him from the trailer, vengeance.

SPEAKER_04 6:00

Vengeance! And vengeance all week.

SPEAKER_01 6:04

Yeah. Or maybe it's a little bit of both.

SPEAKER_04 6:07

Ooh.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

All I do know is that there are very few details to begin with overall, which led to a fairly significant lack in any real nuanced character development. I mean, you can really tell that a movie is basically just a vehicle for Jason Statham to kick ass when the character who owns this company that he works for, they just kind of hand wave away any possibility that he could be corrupt himself by saying like he's been the most honest and trustworthy person who tried to turn around the entire shipping industry. What?

SPEAKER_04 6:47

Like a billionaire in the shipping industry? Not corrupt?

SPEAKER_01 6:52

So you're trying to say that everybody in shipping is corrupt?

SPEAKER_04 6:57

I mean, every billionaire.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

I don't know. It's just obviously there's a lot of this movie that points out at just being a vehicle for Statham.

SPEAKER_04 7:07

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

Luckily, that makes my discussion regarding the cast fairly short, right? Obviously, as I mentioned, this is a Jason Statham ass-kicking vehicle of a movie. So he plays Cole Reed, former police officer, turned bodyguard, which hilariously isn't clear at all based on the trailer. You literally would have to at least look up the movie Showtime to find that out, but it is pretty much in all the descriptions of the movie. Uh, though it's pretty obvious this is one of the less demanding acting roles that he's done. I do think he went all out with the fight choreography, especially the violence and use of found objects in the fights. And it at least seems like this movie could have been more physically demanding than some of his others. So that was interesting and cool, I guess, for him. Annabelle Wallace is Angie Ellis. She's basically the only ally Cole has once he's on the ship, where the majority of the movie takes place. I didn't recognize her, but after looking her up, it seems like this has been one of her only leading roles.

SPEAKER_02 8:15

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 8:16

But she has at least been in supporting roles for a few major studio films, like 2017's The Mummy, starring Tom Cruise. Oh, and more recently, Mercy, starring Chris Spratt and Rebecca Ferguson.

SPEAKER_04 8:30

Oh, no way.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Yeah. I thought she did a great job in this movie, but it was really evident how much this movie was going to be a vehicle for only Statham. Yeah. Once they finally cross paths. She seems to be even more underutilized in the movie. Right. Simon Clough played what I would call the money villain. Since his character really wasn't a physical fighting presence in the movie. However, I definitely would easily assign that fighting presence to Roland Mahler, who played the captain of the container ship. If anyone was an unexpected standout, that dude was. And goddamn, was that guy vascular? Pointing out the whole movie. Straight popping out of his arms, man. It's just too hard to ignore as somebody who was really into viral.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

Let's move into probably the strongest aspects in the movie, which I think were the overall design. Obviously, at the top of the list, fight choreography and cinematography. I remember even when I saw the trailer, the fighting just seemed that much more visceral and impactful than a lot of other fight scenes I've seen them in. All of it feels really grounded in realism. I honestly couldn't pick out any use of CGI. I didn't feel like there was any use of wires or any other tools or techniques that they usually apply to action to kind of exaggerate things. And probably more so in this movie than most of the other movies he's been in. I really think there was good attention to detail as far as the makeup effects gore type stuff because there's not really a lot of that other movies he's been in. But there's a lot of series wounding happening in this movie. It's pretty crazy, but it looks good. Next, I really think the set design is probably the second most significant aspect as far as design went in the movie. The claustrophobic feel of a lot of the areas on the ship were great. I also like how the design of the ship, the parts and the different rooms do kind of integrate smoothly with the pace of the story and the action. So I thought that was cool. And along the same line as fighting with found objects, I really appreciate it. A lot of the fighting also involved use of their immediate surrounding environment.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

Like things you would find in the exact areas that they happen to be in. So um, beyond that, sound and music, while not as upfront as in the trailer, was still solid. There's no doubt that we got a pretty classic action movie score that supports a lot of the intense fight scenes. Uh-huh. But I also appreciated that there was some consideration made as far as catering the score to more tense or emotional scenes within the movie. Moving on to my ratings, I gave this a four for enjoyment and a three for quality.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:27

Even though I didn't find this movie more enjoyable than other Statham movies I've seen, I really feel my still high enjoyment score weighed heavily on the fight choreography and cinematography. Beyond that, I also thought the close quarters layout of the container ship added that claustrophobic feel that really introduced some unpredictability to things. Up Statham and the other actors creeping through these narrow staircases and hallways, leveraging different physical features of the boat and their fighting. The story is pretty light and fairly predictable, and the movie is pretty void of any humor, intentional or not. So I don't feel like viewers get to take a break from the intensity, whether it be a moment of action or suspense, which I think the plot pretty steadily switches between that last bit. I think led to my quality score being lower. Not necessarily because I feel like movies like this always need to be original or have lightness or humor, but because I just feel like the general consensus is that most well-made movies with Statham as a lead typically try to leverage his ability to come off a bit cocky or overconfident. This movie, he was just a serious guy on a mission, which is fine, but it's definitely nothing new. Also, with the exception of some moments involving the US Navy, most of the other characters were only there to be stoic hero or villains or victims, including the other leads. I don't personally have a problem with movies like this that are essentially a vehicle to watch Statham beat a bunch of bad dudes into submission, which I think is evident based on my enjoyment rating. But when the other leads feel as disposable as they did in this movie, everyone seems like a derivative character that I feel like I could probably pick out of another movie. Then I really don't have any excuse to not pull back on the quality score a bit. If the action in this movie delivered something new and innovative, I might have been able to keep from doing so. But I think with the movie being void of any real humor, it was just difficult to find any consistently better than average aspects of the movie beyond just the action. Right. As for related recommendations. I think we even reviewed it, right?

SPEAKER_04 13:59

We sure did as a part of Jerry.

SPEAKER_01 14:02

Right, right, right. It was the kickoff to Jerry. So yeah, same sort of intensity in that movie, though I think with Butler and Coulter both being in it, there's definitely some added humor, both intentional and unintentional. But still the same type of intense action as in this movie. I also want to mention, yeah, like you were saying this movie, I guess a lot of people consider the spiritual successor to Plains, since we're not going to ever get the actual ship movie, it sounds like, but I believe that it fits with the theory. I guess it totally works for me. So yeah, what do you think of uh Mutant?

SPEAKER_04 14:44

Ah man, I was so excited about Mutiny. And walking out of the theater, I was like, hell yeah, that was awesome. I have to admit though, the longer I started thinking about it for discussion, I was like, wait a minute, what happened? Like, like, who were those people?

SPEAKER_01 15:02

I could tell you exactly what happened. We spent 95 minutes less, obviously, with some credits and stuff, just watching Datham mercilessly beat the crap out of people. It really was crazy comparatively to a lot of stuff that he's been in. Well, it's crazy because I think even both of the trailers were both red bands. When I was watching, re-watching the trailers for this review, I was like, holy shit, they definitely redbanded all this stuff.

SPEAKER_04 15:35

I mean, the promotion for this movie across the board has been so good. The trailers were spectacular, they were so violent, so good. Then you've got them doing hundred-foot inflatable Jason Statham sitting on a container ship going down the room. It's so great. And you told me about New York, I believe. They had a setup where there was a stand that said press this button for mutiny, then they had a stunt team come out. They've done all these amazing things. I do wish the movie itself was a little more innovative, but I think that Lionsgate's done such a great job with it.

SPEAKER_01 16:23

I feel like Lionsgate puts out a lot of, for lack of a better word, chunk that we love.

SPEAKER_02 16:30

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

So they can put out some real gems, but I'll even take the crap, dude. I'm cool with the crap. Basically, like, you know, some people are really into Wendy's, even though it's fast food, they would really just eat anything at Wendy's. It doesn't matter. They might be one of those people who's really offended by being asked to eat a McDonald's or Burger King. Oh, but Wendy's for some reason stands differently. I feel like that's like what you get with Lionsgate. Lionscape can give me crap. It's kind of the same with A24 a little bit too. Uh yeah, you can put out complete garbage and I'll at least watch it, call it garbage afterwards, but I'll still watch it.

SPEAKER_04 17:07

Oh man. Oh, Rainbow was a Lionscape film.

SPEAKER_00 17:11

Yeah, I know that.

SPEAKER_04 17:12

Damn, I didn't know that. This is exactly why I think wow. I knew that I liked them, but I didn't know they were and it's Lionsgate.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

Anything that Lionsgate did not actually produce a lot of their distribution of older films are those types of movies. So they know their audience. I highly doubt that these guys have to do any real market research.

SPEAKER_04 17:40

Oh they just got us. They're like, we got them. Oh my god. This movie. Okay. The biggest reason this movie works is because of the fighting and that fucking boat. They actually yeah, they really shot this on an actual 30-year-old feeder ship, and it looks incredible. I mean, you've got engineering rooms, tons of ladders and stairwells and corridors, of course, the shipping containers, the machinery, and the open deck. Oh my God. There's just so many places to fight on a boat. Then you've got the ocean surrounding it. So it's basically like a floor is lava situation. If you fall off, you're fucked.

SPEAKER_01 18:27

The only thing that they could have done to intensify the situation is add sharks to the mix. But you know, Harlan already did that with a plane thing a few months ago.

SPEAKER_04 18:37

That's right. Oh my God. And all the fights take great advantage of it. One of my favorites really does. You've got Statham getting attacked between shipping containers. He looks around for something to use, and obviously we're on a boat. So there's one of those hook things. I don't know what it's for. It's boat stuff. But Statham knows what it's for. It's for stabbing it directly into the cheek of a man's face. So he hooks the guy in the face. Now this guy has a massive hole there. And I won't spoil it. But what happens next made our audience gasp.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

You actually don't even have to spoil it because in trailer two they show that he stabs the man straight through the same hole that he straight through the hole.

SPEAKER_04 19:23

Guys, it goes straight through the same hole. It was beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

And I'm pretty sure that that's not like the only time that happens with something where somebody's wound gets used to deliver a second float.

SPEAKER_04 19:37

Oh my God. It is so funny. Like, okay, insult to injury, literally. They just shoot the boat really well. It's just claustrophobic. There's um a moment where a person or people are on the outside of the ship, which gave me that I I can only call it the IMAX stomach drop feeling. You know? It's not groundbreaking filmmaking, but they really understand what's cool about making an action movie on a giant fucking boat. And they shoot it well. As for Statham himself, I mean, okay, real talk. I'd put this at a B minus Statham scale here. He's extremely competent. And in fact, Statham is so competent that I just kept thinking, oh man, I would want Jason Statham to save me. But here's the thing I feel like he invites more riffraff, you know? So I had this thought to myself during like, would I really want to be on his side or would I just want to hide out? I think I would hide in the stairwell. Yeah. I think some of my favorite Jason Statham movies, they're a little more unhinged than this. You know, give me a crack. Give me one of the increasingly ridiculous transporter movies or spies. Oh my god. God, I love Beekeeper. He's gotta protect the hive. It's so good. Here he's just playing it mostly straight, which he's great at. We love him. He's great at it, but it could have used a little extra charm or weirdness.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

It's not his fault though. I feel like it's no god no.

SPEAKER_04 21:16

It is nothing the movie, it's the script.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

You know, the moment that I noticed it really was when I realized, and this is gonna sound horrible, that I did not care about any of the trafficking happening in the sleepy.

SPEAKER_00 21:32

I just wanted to see stab it.

SPEAKER_01 21:36

Seeing him attack other people. They could have just mentioned the trafficking casually and just had him kicking ass that I would have still taken it.

SPEAKER_04 21:44

I was just excited to be like, what part of the boat are they gonna fight on next? And I really liked how they utilized the sound on the boat because I'll tell you what, boats sound pretty loud. Got characters wearing protective ear covering. Where they have to use a radio to communicate to each other. I'm like, well, that's clever. They just really knew how to use the environment. I think where the movie, yeah, you could use a little oomph would be in the script, just because they don't really do much in terms of character development. Like Cole, he was a cop. His dad was a cop. He plays chess. Hey, three characteristics, baby. That's all we need.

SPEAKER_00 22:26

I never forgot about that part. Yeah, chess.

SPEAKER_04 22:32

Yeah, chess. Villains aren't super memorable. I will agree with you though. I really liked the captain of the ship that David said.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

He was uncharacteristically good for throwaway, I think.

SPEAKER_04 22:45

Yeah, he doesn't have a massive amount of lines. A lot of it's the physicality, and he's just very intimidating.

SPEAKER_01 22:51

He had some good fights though. I did think that it's interesting that they actually had him fight. You see it in the trailer. One of the fights isn't it. Oh yeah, I totally did not connect that, I guess, when I was watching the movie and when it did happen, I was like, oh shit.

SPEAKER_04 23:07

Yeah. And that actor, there's only one other thing that I recognized him for. I was trying to figure out the whole movie. It's actually one of my favorite action movies, Atomic Blonde by David Leach. So I don't recall him having any big fight scenes in that, but I'm like, oh, it makes sense that he would be the heavy in a story like this. I have to admit, I did keep comparing Mutiny to Plain. Plane had some incredibly deep character study. Okay. But I will say, Gerard Bowler and Mike Coulter, they gave them some extra moments to put character into it. They were allowed to have quirks to them. And I think in this movie, hey, they just don't have time. Statham's gotta stab people through an existing facehole and climb around a boat. Time is money. Gotta get on this boat.

SPEAKER_01 23:57

I mean, they literally just gave you the entire backstory of the guy in each trailer. I don't think they were at all trying to spend any time on character development like they did in plain. I know. Just wanted to get straight to the boat as soon as possible.

SPEAKER_04 24:14

It's so cool that they shot it on a real boat. I really recommend if you guys like behind the scenes stuff, there's a really short but fun video on YouTube of them making it. And you can just see how excited all the actors and people making it were to be shooting on a real location, really on the water. I think that's where they put their energy, and I get it. Oh, I will agree with you. The trafficking, I didn't really care about. Like, I think the actors were good. It just felt like it was not as important to the plot. Also, frankly, I'm kind of sick of people being trafficked in shipping containers trope because it's uh kind of obvious, also very far from reality.

SPEAKER_01 24:57

I have to add that I found it kind of amusing. There was like an assortment of people of color. There was. It wasn't just Asians or Latinos. There's just an assortment of people who you would expect to be trafficked, I suppose.

SPEAKER_04 25:16

They shot it in London, so they worked with what they had.

SPEAKER_01 25:20

Yes, yeah, it's whatever their stereotype of the people who typically get trafficked are, I guess.

SPEAKER_04 25:24

Although I will say I don't have the source in front of me, guys, but you can look it up. I got curious about trafficking stats on ships like that. I'm like, it's always in movies, it can't be real. It's a very small percentage, but I did read that up to one-fourth of people working on fishing boats internationally, according to some statistics, are doing forced labor. So that's where a lot of the trafficking actually is. So that's Ashley's trafficking fact of the episode. But getting back to the movie, boats, they're cool, they're scary. Uh that's my take on the matter. Growing up in New England, we always had to go on whale watching school field trips. It made me think of that. And then I remembered, oh, right, we were all puking everywhere at those things. Being on a boat is no joke. So they were out there capturing this footage, filming this movie, all the while they were on a boat that likely made them take dramamine. So shout out to all the actors and crew on this. Um, and then getting to my ratings. So I went back and forth on this a little bit because I did have sort of like how I felt about it walking out and how I felt about it a couple days later.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:43

But I'm gonna go with my walking out score, which is four for enjoyment and three for quality. I was a little disappointed the quality wasn't higher. Wish I loved loved it, but what are you gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 26:56

I'm gonna tell you what you're gonna do. Oh, wow. You're gonna save that love that you wanted to give to this movie, and you're gonna give it to Jason Statham Stole My Bike once that comes.

SPEAKER_04 27:07

Oh my god, guys, have you heard of this? 87 North is producing it. David Leach from The John Wick and all the good movies, and it's real. It's real. They're making a movie about him stealing a bike.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Yeah, Punch Palace Productions, uh Statham's production company is also involved in it. It's on their slate. I I checked it today. So yeah, it's real, it's happened.

SPEAKER_04 27:32

I wonder if he'll stab anyone in a hole in that movie.

SPEAKER_01 27:36

I don't know, man. Isn't there supposed to be kids involved in it? Probably less of that.

SPEAKER_04 27:39

Oh shit. Okay, no, never mind.

SPEAKER_00 27:42

I mean, but I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 27:43

Because he also does some pretty aggressive stuff in Transporter 2. And I know there's a kid in what, like 80% of that movie.

SPEAKER_04 27:50

So that's true, indeed.

SPEAKER_01 27:52

Whatever.

SPEAKER_04 27:53

Oh man. Mutiny.

SPEAKER_01 27:56

Mutiny. Vengeance.

SPEAKER_04 27:59

Vengeance!

SPEAKER_01 28:01

Oh, and by the way, speaking of Stathan, if you're into the guy, then you might want to stick around and check out the uh what we're watching next segment. Because we got pretty pretty big announcements. Yeah. No big deal, but you know, pretty big deal.

SPEAKER_04 28:16

Yeah, yeah, it'll be cool.

unknown 28:18

Yeah.

Movie Review: Spa Weekend

SPEAKER_04 28:21

Well, our next movie should ostensibly be more relaxing than mutiny, but we'll get to that later.

SPEAKER_00 28:28

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_04 28:29

Spa weekend is the latest from John Lucas and Scott Moore, aka the guys behind The Hangover and Bad Moms. So clearly they know their way around a raunchy ensemble comedy at this point. It stars Isla Fisher, Leslie Mann, Anna Ferris, and Michelle Buteau as four lifelong friends. Three of them head to Palm Springs for a much-needed spa getaway, only for their train wreck fourth friend to crash the trip. And as you can imagine, things do not remain particularly relaxing from there. So, Sush, tell me what you thought of Spa Weekend.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

I'm sure it's no surprise to any of our longer-term listeners that we on occasion intentionally select movies that seem to have awful trailers. A lot of the time, it's for movies that look unintentionally funny.

SPEAKER_02 29:21

Hmm.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

But I think this time, at least for me, I was assuming I'd at least be in store for an absurdly over-the-top comedy starring some funny ladies because I've seen these ladies before and other stuff. After all, the first trailer they immediately try to mention that this movie is from the directors of Bad Moms and the writers of The Hangover. So if you're somebody who did enjoy those movies, you're probably the target audience. I myself enjoyed Bad Moms and The Hangover. Probably the latter more than the former, so I figured if this movie were at least as good as Bad Moms, I'd have a good time. After all, it did seem like another movie where the guys in the movie are kind of insufferable and or incapable idiots that have driven the woman our leads to the point of exhaustion that they need a spa weekend, I guess. Which is cool. Though I initially did find it strange that they first set up the women to be the pillars of their relationships and families, and then we soon realized that might not really be the case.

SPEAKER_02 30:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:29

Honestly, I just let that slide since it did look at least funny stupid.

SPEAKER_04 30:36

That was that was the hope.

SPEAKER_01 30:38

Yeah. And it really seemed like the filmmakers, or at least the studio, wanted to emphasize how funny stupid this movie really was, because the second trailer completely cuts out the part that makes the women look like the only competent ones and just goes straight into the crazy spa hijings. Right. Still, I wasn't that deterred and figured that I'd probably see it if I didn't have anything else in mind. So when we finally got to the last weekend, and honestly, we were more focused on making sure we were seeing mutiny than anything.

SPEAKER_04 31:11

It was all about the mutiny this week.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

Yeah. And we also didn't have plans to see anything other than that. I think this just ended up being the default because we remembered it. Seeing the movie, man. I honestly wanted to enjoy it, but it just felt like a lazy version of a better movie that they've already lazy version of even a worse movie. Yeah, I honestly did not think the movie would be as off-putting as it ended up being. First off, while I typically like our four funny lady leads, and most of the other movies I've seen them in, for this movie, I honestly either felt like they weren't developed enough for me to really care about them as much as the stories seemed to call for, or even worse, they were just seriously unlikable for some reason. Yeah. Isla Fisher is Nell. Her character is just the messy friend of the group. I honestly don't think they cared to characterize her as anything beyond that, since she's the only out of the core four that doesn't get an establishing scene before turning up at the spa. I think her character would be fine in most situations, but in this movie, it seems like none of the friends seem legitimately happy to see her.

unknown 32:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

I mean, Michelle Bateau's character, Coco, she pretty much straight up hates her.

SPEAKER_04 32:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

And Coco as a character really doesn't extend very far past that. Because she's basically just the angry black lady. Yeah. Even going as far as making this point in one of her earliest scenes.

SPEAKER_00 32:55

Yes. Though they feel the need to also specify for some reason that she's half black. As if that should somehow affect the stereotype.

SPEAKER_04 33:04

Yeah. Why does any of that matter? It doesn't. And the thing is, they're the ones who wrote it. It's like they wrote the whole movie and they're like, they'll be mad. Let's put a line in so they know we're all right. Yeah, so people can't say anything about it.

SPEAKER_01 33:17

Like acknowledging something gets around it. Yeah. So they barely establish Leslie Mann's character, Jane, as anything beyond her career as a lawyer and role as a single mother. They really have her character come off as completely clueless about anything outside of those two things. And Anaferis' Kai is pretty much the same thing, except she just mentions having kids, and I don't even recall actually seeing them. Because it's more important that we just know how dependent her boss is on her, anyway. It's incredible how unlikable they managed to make these women. Again, given how great each of them are in other movies or TV shows I've seen him in. It's like the filmmakers purposely made an effort to do so, but then even gave up halfway through that.

SPEAKER_02 34:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:03

The only actor I really enjoyed in this movie was Dominic Ona Ariki. Oh yeah. Like Roger, that dude was just too good for both her and this goddamn movie. I think the strangest part about this movie, though, being so bad was that it came from two guys who were known for writing The Hangover, which was a financial and critical success. Also, both writing and directing bad moms, which even though wasn't as good as The Hangover, at least seemed to have a lot of heart beyond all the crazy slips of comedy. I just didn't get how this movie could have gotten it so wrong. It legit seemed like they wanted to create a quartet of some of the worst stereotypes of middle-class American women they could find. Yeah. But didn't even finish the job. No. And the dudes are honestly no better in this movie. Everyone in this movie just seems like the worst, if not laziest, version of a stereotype. I think the only aspect of this movie that's even worth spending time on is the design. I mean, the spa where pretty much the entire movie takes place is beautiful. I honestly feel like the place is huge, but it's more due to the design than the different sets of rooms that we see, given that the only services we really see during the entire movie are the pool in the pool side lounging area, outdoor yoga area, indoor yoga area where the goat yoga happens, you know, a dog room, the kitchen, and maybe an indoor massage area. Oh, right, and the actual rooms that they stay in, which I don't even recall seeing aside from the party scene that we also see in the trailer. I'll give credit to some of the stunts performed for physical comedy, but there aren't even that many I can recall aside from goat yoga and golf cart hijinks, both of which, like the other few highlights of this movie, were in the trailer. Score and soundtrack weren't bad. I just wish the movie itself were better, so I could have actually enjoyed or remembered experiencing that part of the movie a bit more. I think the soundtrack worked for the notably crazy moments in the movie because the songs they picked paired well with what was going on. But aside from that, I can't really recall any of it having much impact. Though that could unfortunately just be due to how much I progressively disliked this movie the further I got through it. Going into my ratings, I gave us a two for enjoyment and a one and a half for quality. Like I said at the start of my review, I honestly wanted to enjoy this movie, and the trailer almost made me believe that was possible. But seeing the movie, I realized how hard it almost was to keep things that made the movie so dislikable out of the trailer. The biggest aspect for me, anyway, was how horrible they made the Coco character out to be. Yeah. And legitimately awful situations and moments were really what made this movie difficult to enjoy all around. Aside from a few legitimately hilarious slapstick moments and maybe some of Mel's outbursts and various hot mess moments where it seems like everyone on set is having a good time. It was like watching four middle-aged women somehow be the worst stereotypes. Yes. So yeah, I couldn't give it more than a two for enjoyment. Quality, it just sucked. Seriously. I had absolutely no idea that the movie could be as bad as it ended up being, given that the two notable movies these filmmakers worked on were pretty good. But it just was. It would have even been fine if they were lazy about all the character development and just focus on making the comedy aspects of the movie the best parts. But that's not what happened.

SPEAKER_02 37:47

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:57

I seriously was like, why are these women like this the longer you watch this movie? So I'm just glad that by the time I made it to the credits, there are at least outtakes that made it seem like the actors have fun. As far as related recommendations go, I'm gonna suggest an actual good movie about uh only two friends, one of them also being kind of a mess, but definitely way more fun and kinder with characterization, which would be one of them days.

SPEAKER_04 38:26

Oh, hell yeah. I was one of our favorites. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:29

Kiki Palmer and Sizza. No spas, but a much stronger friend bond and just overall writing, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_02 38:38

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_01 38:39

Yeah, check that one out if you want to see something with your lady friends where it's silly, crazy. Check that one out. Don't see this movie. Don't see this movie. Please don't. I mean, I usually don't really care if people end up seeing movies that we don't really like, but this one I really feel like it's a disservice to society to spread stuff like this.

SPEAKER_04 39:02

Sometimes, though, you want to be angry. There's that.

SPEAKER_01 39:07

Maybe. What'd you say?

SPEAKER_04 39:10

Oh my god, this movie. Hey, I just kept thinking about how last week we talked about a stoner comedy that made me cry about friendship.

SPEAKER_03 39:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 39:21

Okay. This week we're talking about a movie about friendship that made me angry. I hated this movie. And that's not something, well, I say privately all the time, but I'm not going to say publicly about most things. This one, I publicly on the record hated it. I knew Spa Weekend was probably going to be kind of bad. But I don't necessarily think that's a problem. There's plenty of movies that aren't the greatest that I still find really entertaining. I was hoping for a laundry folding movie or maybe a stomach flu movie, something where you don't have to think too hard, but it keeps you just entertained enough. There's a lot of really funny people there. I thought maybe they could spruce it up a bit, give it some personality. But pretty much as soon as Isla Fisher's character enters, I was like, what the fuck is this? Because the movie treats her like she's the wacky friend. And listen, I have plenty of wacky friends.

SPEAKER_02 40:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 40:29

I am the wacky friend. Okay. But wacky is showing up in a weird outfit or talking too much. It's not destroying things and ruining people's livelihoods.

SPEAKER_01 40:41

Yeah, or purposely putting them in situations you know they would not want to be in just because, oh, get out of your comfort zone.

SPEAKER_04 40:49

Her behavior is so far beyond normal human behavior that I'm not thinking, oh God, we all have that friend, like they think we will. I'm thinking, how has this woman functioned in society for this long? How has she reached middle age? Then the movie just keeps returning to this idea that every friend group has one friend that everybody hates. I'm like, no, that's literally not true. What are you talking about? Certainly not in middle age. I mean, sure, in a large group of friends, you might have an acquaintance you're not as close with, but these are supposed to be close, lifelong friends. And I think that bothered me so much because I didn't believe these women were even friends in the first place. They show a picture of them when they're young. That's it. But I don't get a sense for what their dynamic is. I don't know who's calling who about what gossip. I don't know who is listening to the same podcast about survivor. You know, they don't seem to have inside jokes. They don't seem to have any affection for each other. I didn't sense any joy. They could be coworkers for all I know. And especially as you get older, friendship takes work. People's lives naturally separate because you've got job, kids, partners, all that other shit going on. So why would these women put all that effort into maintaining a friendship with someone who I don't know is a psychopath? And yet they keep hanging out out of guilt. What? What is that by this age? Yeah. But mostly it just seems like they're just trying to survive each other. And I think the bigger problems is this movie doesn't know shit about women. Okay. When we saw the trailer for this the first time in the theater, there's a gay couple sitting next to us, and one of them said to the other, Oh, that movie looked like it was written by men. And they were very right.

SPEAKER_02 43:02

It was.

SPEAKER_04 43:03

Yeah. It feels like the writers overheard their wives complain about real things, like women doing an unfair amount of labor in many families, or women being held to higher expectations, or parents being overwhelmed. Like, yeah, those are problems.

SPEAKER_01 43:20

Yeah, maybe back when they made bad moms, they already knew this stuff. Why do I feel like the moms that literally met during the course of the movie Bad Moms are more genuine friends than these four?

SPEAKER_04 43:38

Absolutely. It's the same people made this movie.

SPEAKER_01 43:41

That's really, I think, what drove me crazy about her, what made me legitimately dislike this movie. Because it's not like you guys haven't done this.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:52

We made it easier for you, in fact. They all are supposed to get along.

SPEAKER_04 43:56

What the all you have to do is have women get along. You clowns, you can't picture that. What does that mean? I'm so sorry I called someone a clown, but it really upset me. And the character development is laughably small. In a Jason Statham movie, no fucking big deal. Just put him in an outfit. I'll guess his job. He can stab people in their face holes.

SPEAKER_01 44:21

At least they told us his entire backstory in the trailer for that movie.

SPEAKER_04 44:25

Yeah. Here it's like, okay, wait. Anna Ferris, her character works too much. She has kids. Michelle Buteau's character is divorced and has kids and is angry. And okay. I gotta stop actually before I go into the next. Her character really enraged me because they literally make a joke about the angry black woman stereotype as if they didn't write it that way. That really, really made me so mad. Michelle Buteau is a great actress. I really like her. And I just feel bad for her to have to be in that kind of a role. Also, okay, Sush, you made a good point when we were discussing this offline. The men in the movie are framed as reasonable.

SPEAKER_01 45:18

Some of them. Some of them. The ones you actually get to meet more than once throughout the course of the movie.

SPEAKER_04 45:25

Right. So it's like they're trying to contrast, like the men are just trying to figure it out. And these women are crazy. It's insane. Even Leslie Mann's little romance with the yoga instructor annoyed me because she meets this man, then he basically makes her feel bad. She's busy and can't see him again like the next day. Sir, you just met her yesterday. I'm sorry she doesn't have enough time to clear up her schedule.

SPEAKER_01 45:53

She can't accommodate your 20-something year old schedule or whatever it is.

SPEAKER_04 45:58

I know, but the way the movie writes it, the way everyone acts, this is the second time her characters had someone be like, oh, we can't go on a date for three months. I guess it'll never happen. Well, you know what? For her, why would you go with someone who couldn't go with your schedule? Literally. Why are they so demanding and acting like it's her fault and there's something wrong with her? Oh my God. Also, as someone who loves the spa, I resent the anti-spa propaganda in this movie. You'd think you would be pro-spa because it's called Spa Weekend, but they make the spa seem all pretentious and ridiculous and not particularly helpful. That is simply not true. The spa is amazing. And shout out to you, King Spa. I love you forever.

SPEAKER_01 46:45

Yeah, and King Spa actually shows, well, not always, but on occasion, there's action movies that are being played. Um did I'm not sure how that promotes relaxation. I mean, I get it for us, but I don't know for other people how that promotes relaxation.

SPEAKER_04 47:00

Oh my god. One time I was there with Chelsea, who has been on the pod, and we were and had had a massage. The movie they played was Rambo. And we just sat there laughing so hard, like, what a wonderful experience. You know what? That was less jarring than this movie. This movie, oh my god. You know what? And another movie I compared this to is Summer Camp. Okay. It's an old ladies gone wild movie with Kathy Bates and a bunch of other great gals. That movie, it was stupid as well. But I loved it because it was watchable underneath this ridiculous premise. They had real friendship and rapport and they supported each other. They wanted good things for each other. I mean, these women didn't seem to like each other, let alone be friends. Okay. And lastly, do not tell me you're making a movie about the pressures women face, then write the women like this. Okay. You're gonna tell me this movie is about friendship, and these people could be strangers. What is this? And here's what's even worse. My fear is that this movie gets bad reviews, nobody watches it, and someone at a studio says, Well, I guess people don't want movies about middle-aged women and female friendships. We do, dude. Just don't write women like this.

SPEAKER_02 48:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 48:42

So don't see this. Go see the wrong girls twice. It's so good. It's gonna give you everything you want from this and more psychedelic. So highly recommend. Oh, but for my ratings here, one and one. This is a piece of dog shit. I hate it.

SPEAKER_01 48:59

Damn. I know that every once in a while you get aggressive about a movie, but I really agree with you on this one.

SPEAKER_04 49:06

Yeah, you know what? I actually was generous by doing one and one. I was gonna give it double point five.

SPEAKER_01 49:12

Do you know why I personally felt offended by this as a child of a single mother, having the single mom role stereotyped in such a way that you don't have any room for anything else? Sure, that may be true, but do you want to promote that?

SPEAKER_04 49:31

They don't even have interest, they don't watch TV, they don't know. Yeah, that's what I mean.

SPEAKER_01 49:35

You don't want to promote that idea. If anything, that just creates that situation and it makes it the norm. And it causes their kids to start thinking that they're that way. So I don't know. I get that this movie was trying to be funny, but I I just feel like the lack of care put into it ended up causing it to be maybe even harmful.

SPEAKER_04 49:57

I definitely would consider it harmful.

SPEAKER_01 49:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 50:00

Let alone for all the damage that goddamn Isla Fisher's character does in this movie. You will not believe the garbage she does in this. Look it up on Wikipedia later. Don't see it.

SPEAKER_01 50:12

Yeah, I don't see it.

SPEAKER_04 50:13

Uh, okay, TV next. That'll be better.

SPEAKER_01 50:16

That'll yeah, we would bury ourselves underground with the mole people.

SPEAKER_04 50:20

Oh yeah. Let's go. I want to burrow away from this piece of shit movie. I'm so sorry. There's talented people involved, but you know what it is.

SPEAKER_02 50:32

Yeah.

TV Episode Recap: Silo - Season 3, Episode 8 - "Gray Goo"

SPEAKER_04 50:37

Hey sushi.

SPEAKER_01 50:39

We're up.

SPEAKER_04 50:40

Did I let Fisher's character in Spa Weekend give you so much secondhand embarrassment that you wanted to burrow into the earth and live there for hundreds of years?

SPEAKER_01 50:50

You mean like a mole person?

SPEAKER_04 50:52

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 50:52

No, but that's a good lead-in to a recap of silo for the week.

SPEAKER_04 50:58

Oh, right. They are in a hole in the ground.

SPEAKER_01 51:01

Yeah. We're on season three, episode eight, titled Grey Goo. The episode opens outside Silo 17, where we see Patrick Kennedy on the ground. Suddenly he awakens and begins running towards Lucas Kyle, who is conscious, but unfortunately wounded. Patrick helps him across the wasteland to safety, with the residents of 17 initially hesitating to open the airlock, but luckily the mention of Juliet's name eventually convinces them to allow the two to enter. Jimmy, who we also know as Solo, Audrey, and the younger survivors begin treating Lucas, whose radio was damaged when he was shot. Jimmy repairs the radio as Patrick looks at all the artifacts he's posted on the walls. Once the radio is repaired, we see the same call he made to Martha and Juliet to confirm his arrival at Silo 17, only this time from his point of view. And eventually the conversation ends with Juliet informing Jimmy they need to look into what happened to his mom and that Patrick would give him the details. Then we get the episode's first before time scene at Pear Stenson's construction site, where we see the large drill or digger as they refer to them. He hosts Daniel, Helen, and Charlotte at a home built near the site where they learn that he intends to build 50 underground silos and invites them to dinner with Anna and Senator Thurman as they reveal his plan to use the silos to house selected people and preserve art and knowledge following an anticipated global catastrophe. Oh man. Back in silo 18, the algo orders Camille to investigate the true purpose behind Juliet sending Lucas and Patrick to silo 17. Elsewhere, Knox confronts his father, Gus, about Ed Harwood and stolen supplies. Over in silo 17, we see Jimmy, Patrick, and the kids come across a door that was welded shut, with Patrick pointing out it was done so from the inside. Returning to 18, we see Camille questioning and imprisoned Robert. He refuses to betray Juliet's mission and is actually able to seemingly regain the upper hand by convincingly arguing that there simply couldn't be an ulterior motive given attempting anything beyond rescue would potentially endanger those children's lives.

SPEAKER_02 53:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:39

In silo 17, they cut through the welded door where they find a body wearing a cleaning suit, which turns out to be Jimmy's mother. Though she attempted to seal the safeguard pipe, we're led to believe she realized she couldn't at some point, needing her to seal herself inside the compartment to protect Jimmy and the rest of the silo. Patrick tells Jimmy they need to move her, but he refuses to let them. Sheriff Billings and Hank arrive to meet with Knox at Gus's home, and Gus admits to designing a hidden transportation system connected to the mines. Meanwhile, Bernard explains the safeguard system to Julia and provides a diagram showing how the silos connect to silo one. He believes that physically blocking the pipe would deprive the algo of utilizing the safeguard. Bernard also admits that he killed Judge Meadows under the Algo's orders, explaining that his experience has destroyed his faith in the system he once served. Returning to the before times greenhouse dinner party, Stenson continues with his story of how the specific doomsday scenario he envisioned ultimately led to this plan. And he and Senator Thurman detail what the plan actually is. They then reference Charlotte's mission, reinforcing beliefs that an enemy of the U.S. had already developed an inexpensive nanoweapon through its encounter with Iran's gray goo, which they believe could eventually threaten all humanity. Helen tries to point out how Charlotte and her team were basically used as guinea pigs to confirm suspicions, which leads to Charlotte running back to the house as she starts to have a panic attack. Back in silo 17, Patrick updates a recovering Lucas on the situation and tries to get him to convince Jimmy to let them move his mother's body. However, Lucas reasonably feels like Patrick is probably better suited for that job, given his proven ability to influence others through his involvement in silo 18's resistance. So the task ends up solely in Patrick's lap. In silo 18, we see Nox Billings and Hank at Carla's office and supply, informing her of Gus's hidden transport, leading them to believe Ed Harwood likely kept quiet regarding Orla's murder to prevent anyone from finding out about it, as it'd definitely be something that results in them being sent to clean. We return to 17, where Patrick musters up the courage to speak to Jimmy and decides to tell him a story of his wife, Doris, and Silo 18's burial traditions, which he in turn provides for Jimmy's mother. Jimmy finally permits Lucas to examine his mother's work on the pipe, leading to him revealing to Jimmy that his parents died as heroes. We cut to silo 18, where Shirley is updating Juliet and everyone else on the findings regarding the safeguard at 17. They devise a plan to have Sandy and Shirley locate Silo 18's safeguard pipe and block it off. Back in supply, Carla joins Billing's investigation team as they search for and apparently find the missing light bulbs. Meanwhile, Juliet realizes that Bernard's map has led them towards the wrong direction and races after Shirley to warn her. In the before times, Stenson grows notably frustrated with Helen questioning his deep money in the face of other arguably more immediate worldwide concerns. It's revealed by Senator Thurman that she and Daniel were brought there to be offered positions in the project. They have an amusing moment where Knox is confirmed as the father and Shirley tells Juliet how emotional he was getting the news. Charlotte accepts, leaving Daniel the only one left as Anna tries to convince him to join. And Stenson even agrees to supply 50 diggers, which Daniel expressed would be necessary to ensure success of the plan. But before he's able to respond, Helen decides to leave. Things get tense in Silo 18 as Julia comes to the realization that Sandy's coded message was a warning that she's been found by judicial and they're looking for them. We then cut to Ed being confronted by the sheriffs and Knox, who after some questioning reveals that Mike Davidson killed Orla Kent after she discovered him stealing from supply, leading to Mike's arrest resolving the investigation into Orla's murder. We return to the before times as we see Charlotte follow Daniel out. They share one final memory of their family before he reunites with Helen, already in the helicopter, preparing to take off. Daniel professes his feelings and the two kiss as Dr. Serenkovich watches their helicopter take off to the distance from the house. With Orla's murder investigation now over, Sheriff Billings reunites with his wife in the cafeteria. As elsewhere in the silo, we see Juliet surrendered to a judicial, so Shirley can continue with the plan. Camille appears as Juliet thrown into the same cell as Robert, making clear that she now considers both of them enemies. The episode ends with Juliet now in prison with Robert, as Shirley and the remaining allies must find and disable the safeguard without her. Ashley, what did you think?

SPEAKER_04 1:00:15

Oh, I really liked this episode. It's cool. We're starting to see some of the mentality that eventually creates the silo as we know it, where these people are so convinced that the world is a danger and the stakes are so high that they're willing to do basically anything that they think is for the greater good. And I think that moment really crystallized for me when Daniel confronting Paris Stinson about the way they brought him to the meeting. Like, hey, when we were on our way here, we thought we were gonna die. We thought you were driving us to our deaths. Paris' response is essentially good. You needed to feel that way so you'd understand how important this is. Oh, okay. Because if you're willing to make someone genuinely fear for their life just to get them to see things your way, then what else are you gonna do? And you know, obviously we've seen how the silo turns out, so we know where this is headed. Weirdly, that made me think about Bernard because we see he talks about how much she regrets killing the judge. The algorithm told him death was necessary, or basically everyone in the silo would die. And he believed it, but now he knows it's not true. So I'm starting to wonder: man, is that really almost the modus operandi of the algorithm? Does it just automatically, when it doesn't get its way, tell people the whole silo is gonna die? It's like this really evil way of controlling people, and I think I'm starting to understand Bernard a little more because you actually see why someone like him was chosen for the job. He's incredibly intelligent and he's extremely manipulative, but also he never really questioned the basic premise of what he was being told. He can almost manipulate himself into believing that what he was doing was right. He talks about that and about questioning it. Granted, the man had to be lit on fire and almost die to get there, but that's progress, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:16

Then, oh my gosh, when Juliet tells him I hate not hating you, I was like, Yes, that's how I've been feeling about Bernard this whole season. Like, I still don't trust this man at all, but unfortunately, I do understand a bit more now.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:32

Oh my god, on a completely different emotional level. I loved Patrick Kennedy in this episode. I was really moved. That part where they needed to move Jimmy's mom's body, and Jimmy does not want to let them. Kennedy, he just innately understands, telling him we need this right now, just telling him what to do. That's not gonna work. Jimmy's an adult man, but emotionally, he's basically a kid who just lost his parents and has had nobody there to help him process it.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:03

Right.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:03

So Kennedy meets him where he is. He tells Jimmy how they honor the dead in Silo 18, promises they'll give his mother a beautiful ceremony where he can pay tribute to her and say goodbye. He helps Jimmy understand that his mother died protecting him and everyone else. And it's cool because it's incredibly compassionate, but it's also really smart in getting him what he wants.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:28

I like that because it's one of those situations where Lucas brings it up. Yeah, Patrick did get a bunch of people to join the resistance. So he obviously knows how to talk to people, even though he comes off as kind of a dick.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:45

But yeah, he's kind of ornery.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:47

You know, there's gotta be something, not only because he was able to recruit people, but I mean he was married, so you would have his wife sounds like a pretty reasonable lady. How would she end up with a guy like that if there's not something redeemable? Uh some aspect of his personality that is likable.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:06

You know what's interesting when they were talking about his wife in previous episodes. I was like, why do they keep talking about the wife? What's her involvement? Thinking it was going to be some plot development out of it. But instead, I think it was for us to see an emotional journey that he goes on. Yeah. Because when we first are seeing him this season, he's just so shut down and ordery and disagreeable. And you get to see where he would have warmth in his life with his wife. And here we get to see it manifest. So it's a nice progression of his character.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:38

For sure.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:39

Oh my god. Then there's whatever the hell is going on with Charlotte and Anna, because at this point, they gotta be in a relationship. The looks these two are giving each other are not casual at all. Anna gets very protective when Charlotte's upset and has the panic attack. And when Charlotte is deciding whether to join the silo project, she looks at her brother first, but then she has this long stare with Anna, who looks so emotional. So I don't necessarily think Charlotte knew her mission was bait. And I definitely don't think she knows what the silos are eventually going to become. But I feel like she must have a relationship with Anna and trust her.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:25

It's weird because she lost her memory and apparently has been trying to work on regaining that. When exactly would they have met? Did they know each other from before the memory loss? And now it's just part of the memories that Dr. Cerkovich was able to restore. Or is this something new that I don't know, maybe just because she has access to Charlotte, maybe she's been around whenever Daniel hasn't been in the past? It's just weird. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:54

It is. I mean, I think of everything going into the next episode. I wouldn't think finding out the relationship dynamic. Between these two ladies would be the thing I was most looking forward to. But it is because I'm just so curious.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:07

Yeah. It's crazy. And when they get Charlotte to join, they get her to join the project to be a drone pilot. Like, hold on. Because in the quote, present of the show, we just learned that drones are monitoring the area around the silos.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:24

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:25

So I'm also wondering were drones the things that shot Kennedy and Lucas?

SPEAKER_01 1:06:30

Oh, I'm pretty sure that was a solution. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:33

And that got me thinking, how much are they aware of the rest of the world status in silo one or whoever's controlling things? I don't know. This show turns me into a conspiracy theorist, I swear. Also, I really in this episode like Colin Hanks' performance. I thought he was great. He has this arrogance and gravitas. Okay, here's the worst part though. I was watching, I was like, man, he's great. But I started picturing what if Chet Hanks did this role? Can you even imagine what I wouldn't give to see uh a Chet Hanks, a Paris Stinson, probably doing it with the patois. But yeah. Okay. And then the last thing, the kiss. Helen and Daniel kiss. So early on, I was thinking there was something there. And you won me over with your Helen's way too good for this guy point of view.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:28

It was more I don't care for them to have something. It's not that I couldn't go in towards that. Like, what else are they gonna do? They've paired these two people together on this journey, dealing with all these consequences together. So there's no way that this isn't heading that in that direction. I just didn't want it to go there because I really didn't think that he was cool enough.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:53

He's this cray cray. Um, gosh, I wonder if I still say cray cray now. Got me questioning myself. The other thing that I thought is in this world where everything is so manipulated, it probably isn't the wisest thing to be kissing on a helicopter that Paris Stinson owns where the pilot's gonna see it. Now they know you're connected, now they've got another way to manipulate you.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:19

But they already got a sister, so they're I know, I know.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:24

Yeah, I also loved Ed Harwood's whole thing. The way he described wanting to steal the light bulbs made me think of when people hoarded toilet paper during COVID.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:34

Right.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:35

He was like, Oh, I think there was gonna be a rebellion, so I needed all the light bulbs.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:39

Yeah, funny.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:40

I thought it was a really interesting episode. I'm curious what you thought about it. What do you think?

SPEAKER_01 1:08:46

Well, I love the shot in the before times where the team approaches the drill or the digger as they call it. Daniel just looks up at it and you get the shot showing how massive the thing is before cutting to the opening credits.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:00

It's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:01

Yeah, like, okay, shit. That's certainly a way to start an episode.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:06

Show us some scale.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:08

But yeah, while I feel that the before-time scenes in this episode felt considerably less of a waste of time compared to those over the previous two, I personally just hate the before-time sending we got with Daniel and Helen kissing, like you were saying when you were talking about the episode. I just think Helen is too cool for Daniel. Yeah, I mean, goddamn, girl. At least go for the real Seth Myers instead of this knockoff.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:41

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:42

Can I actually go through with it?

SPEAKER_00 1:09:44

Yeah, come on.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:47

As far as the style stuff goes, I love the scene with Nax showing up at his dad's door.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:53

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:54

Culminating with Nax being like, how does it taste? before jacking him so hard in the face that he knocks the dude on his ass. Like, nice.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:03

Hell yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:04

As somebody with some deadbeat dad uh issues myself. Oh man, that seems like it would be fun. Uh also, it's so crazy how much of a turn Robert Sims has had on the show.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:19

I know. Damn, man. Who is he?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:23

It slowly revealed how much he really is an ally of Juliet's. With them both kind of sharing the same core beliefs that people should be able to exist and have the right to know what the hell is going on in the world around them. But yeah, I think the most interesting aspect of Robert's character arc for me is that they were able to make him so immediately believable. Really that we truly felt he was the person he claimed to be by tying it all back to him prioritizing his own family above everyone else.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:55

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:56

That's something you can absolutely believe, even taking into account the sketchy shit that he's done previously. The motivation is there, but I like how they build on that positively with him realizing his beliefs do align with Juliet's. Like, how could you believe anything but the kids? They can't guarantee anything but the kids. Anything else happening will immediately be noticeable. So I thought that was great. Uh speaking of Lucas and Patrick, I'm glad we found out Lucas was going to be okay, even though he did get shot. This was the episode where we learned whoever is behind the algo likely utilizes drones. Since Charlotte was offered a job to pilot them in the before time scenes, I'm fairly certain that's what Lucas was shot by, since it would explain the buzzing noise prior to the gunfire. With everything going on at 17, I really like how it wasn't simply a whole episode spent doing just that. And we kind of layer on the next part of what develops in 18 on top of it and kind of get from there. I like that structurally. I also like how we saw a softer side of Patrick Kennedy as we were talking about Lucas right. The guy definitely does know how to get people to see things his way. But beyond that, I'm glad that Lucas does help out with the effort by really emphasizing how Jimmy's parents died as heroes.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:50

Even though I think that everyone in the resistance is certainly capable of carrying on without Juliet, I'm obviously still interested in seeing where all that leads to, especially with Robert being held in the same cell as her name.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:03

Oh man.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:04

With those two, I almost feel like they'll work together to figure out a plan to escape before the resistance can even plan and execute any rescue from the scheme. Yeah, but hey, I'd love to see her and Robert do a prison break. So overall, I think this episode really built up a lot of the silo plots ahead of what I expect will be a battle between the algo and judicial and the resistance. But I'm also curious to see what happens with the before times timeline. I don't think uh we're done with it, especially with some awareness, what happens to Daniel's character in the books that I found out through various YouTube videos. I just have a feeling that uh it's not the last that that we've seen, at least of Daniel.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:56

Cool. All right. Well, next week, penalty. I always love a penalty. They always set up a lot of fun stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:04

Yeah. So let's uh I guess make like Helen and Daniel and uh take flight.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:14

Ooh.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:15

Yeah, moving on to lanterns.

TV Episode Recap: Lanterns - Season 1, Episode 2 - "Trust Fall"

SPEAKER_01 1:14:22

Alright. So, lanterns, we are on episode two, titled Trustfall. We open in 2016 again, shortly after the deadly shooting at Rushville's football field. Hal wakes John with a bucket of water and follows up with a half-assed attempt training John to fly. Uh, John fails to do so, instead, creating a construct in the form of a small bird. Curiously, the construct remains alive after John removes the power ring. And though we see Hal notice the anomaly, he doesn't bother mentioning anything to John. Uh with a ring nearly depleted, he sends John to his coast city home to retrieve his lantern to recharge it, assigning him the additional tasks of feeding Earl, which he doesn't bother explaining, and keeping the bird construct alive.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:19

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:20

Hal returns to the football field alone to examine the metal detectors installed around it. When ordinary metal fails to activate them, he begins to suspect they serve a different purpose. He then interrupts the town meeting as they discuss whether the next football game should proceed. Billy Macon sneaks over and takes the seat next to Hal, informing him that his assault charges have been dropped, seemingly clearing the way for him to leave Rushville. Instead, but Town's eagerness to get rid of him makes Hal more determined to continue investigating. In Coast City, John arrives at Hal's extravagant home and searches for the lantern. John reaches out to Hal by phone, who leads him to and helps open a voice-activated container leading to a pocket dimension where the lantern's so cool. Yeah. As that's happening in Rushville, we see Hal's moved on to stealing the dead aliens' bodies from the moor. John then encounters Earl, Hal's enormous carnivorous plant, and feeds it as instructed. We cut to Hal arriving at the football stadium with the corpses, passing them through the detectors, which sets them off, confirming that they are designed to identify extraterrestrials instead of metal.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:44

So cool. Love it.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:46

John, having retrieved the lantern, returns Hal's hide key to its previous location. However, as he's doing so, several apparently non-human attackers ambush him with a stun gun and carry him away in a van. He manages to escape the van as it's on the highway in the middle of oncoming traffic. And though he's initially incredibly lucky, evading his captors and dodging the cars and collisions they've caused, he ends up getting knocked out. Back in Rushville, we see Hal hilariously driving through town with the bodies seat belted as if they were passengers. Before immediately being pulled over by Sheriff Kane. Although furious with his methods, she accompanies him when he decides to confront William Macon about the technology. At Macon's compound, Hal ignores warnings to remain outside and steps onto the property, leading to Macon's guards shooting him.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:45

Oh man.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:47

Meanwhile, John's captors reveal they're led by an alien named Anton. They explain they came to Earth hunting a manhunter, a race of synthetic beings capable of constructing new bodies, impersonating species, and introducing technology far beyond an infiltrated civilization's natural development. Using an alien device, Anton forcibly transmits visuals directly into John's brain, showing him how a manhunter engineered the destruction of their world. Though a Green Lantern once captured the creature, it escaped during transport, and its distinctive radiation has now been traced to Rushville. Through their conversation, Anton is astonished to learn hell never taught John about the Manhunters, and is equally surprised that John can sustain what seems like a living construct without actually wearing a lantern ring, hinting at John's ability being extremely unusual. John's eventually released with an ultimatum. He has 48 hours to locate the Manhunter or the aliens will destroy Rushville and a large part of the surrounding area to ensure the creature cannot escape. Back in Rushville, Hal awakens in an unnervingly empty and pristine hospital where Carrie vents her feelings that Rushville is beginning to lose control. The two agree they must work together more carefully since openly provoking Macon could strengthen his influence over the frightened town. Upon John's return to Rushville, he stops in at a diner for a cup of coffee, only to coincidentally run into Zoe Macon, William's wife, again. John can't seem to figure her out, especially with Zoe claiming to actually love her husband, but the conversation they share implies that she, as a woman of color, puts up with William for the security or access he's able to provide her as a white man before she changes the topic to ask John how things have been with his white man, Hal. John confesses to her that he's trying to figure out if he can trust him before we cut to him arriving back at his motel. He tells Hal about his encounter with Anton, despite being instructed to keep the encounter secret. Recognizing the seriousness of the threat, Hal dons his Green Lantern uniform and takes off into space, eventually arriving at an intergalactic prison. Then appears at the cell where Sinestro, his former mentor and disgraced former Green Lantern, is being kept. Hal demands he tell him what he knows of Manhunters, but instead, Sinestro turns his attention towards Jon Stewart, implying he's somehow a greater concern, ending the episode with an ominous warning about Hal's new trainee. So, what did you think about the second episode of Lanterns?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:46

Oh, I loved it. I'm still a little confused about exactly what's going on with manhunters in Rushville, but I'm very invested and I'm getting more and more theories, I swear. I'm really interested in Hal and John's relationship because there's something about it that's really fun, but there's also something about it that makes me a little uncomfortable. They're fundamentally different people. John is rigid and by the book and spent his whole life working incredibly hard and being told, especially by his dad, that he has to work harder than everyone else to prove himself. Then you've got Hal, who literally was just handed a green lantern ring one day and seems to operate almost entirely on instinct. That contrast can be really funny. Hal basically tells John, okay, time to fly. Just think about flying. And John tries, accidentally manifests this green bird. Then they discover the ring is out of juice. Like, okay, great lesson, Hal. Thanks. But there's also times where Hal's dismissiveness towards John really bothers me. Um give him information, makes him figure things out on his own, making him do kind of menial things.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:02

I think he's doing it to just get him out of the way while he's trying to investigate.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:10

I think that's exactly what he's trying to do. Yeah, but I don't think it's being received that way. Um, even all of that aside, I think John's starting to like Hal despite himself, because aliens kidnap him and tell him, hey, there's a genocidal robot thing hiding somewhere in Rushville that could look like anyone. Don't tell anybody. When he gets back, he's even really thinking about whether he's gonna tell Hal. But then he does. He decides to put his press like the title of the episode, wasn't it? Trustfall. So that's a pretty big leap of faith. Oh, also there's something about Hal that I love, which is watching someone who gives no fucks is sort of fantasy fulfillment for me sometimes. Like we've all had situations where you know exactly what needs to be done, but there's some stupid rule or person in the way, and Hal just ignores it. Like, oh, I think those are um metal detectors, detect aliens. No one's gonna do anything. Let me just go steal some alien corpses. This guy gets things done. That was amazing. That whole bit killed me. Then him driving around with the dead aliens in the back. Oh my God, getting pulled over by Carrie like it's just a normal day. I love it. Also, Hal's confidence in confronting Macon. He's so confident it doesn't occur to him that he would get shot, but he does. And I'm sorry he's injured, but that was hilarious. And opens up what I think is one of the freakiest things of this episode that the hospital has no other people there, essentially. It's so bizarre, so eerie. That got me into all kinds of theories. Like, how is it that they don't get injured or don't go to the hospital? Maybe the people of the town are protecting the manhunter and they get immortality. I don't know. I could not stop thinking about it. All the manhunter stuff was pretty powerful. Great performances, both from the actors playing the aliens and obviously with early Jon Stewart. They did such a great job showing how affected they were by the Manhunter. It was great because it gives you a sense for how formidable this creature's gonna be and how evil he's gonna be once we meet him. Overall, great episode. And okay, returning to my predictions based on absolutely no Green Lantern knowledge from last episode. Number one, my theory about John's mom dying when he was young. It's still standing. I sort of feel like the green bird could be connected because when Hal asked him, hey, you just manifested that out of nowhere. So it must be part of something powerful and personal to you. John is just like, don't worry about it and brushes it off. So I feel like there's something there. And then two, that something traumatic happened to Hal within the last 10 years. Well, now we know he took down Sinestro after his whole thing. So he's had a lot going on as the Green Lantern. And then three, all right. My theory that Billy's parents are aliens. I don't know about that one, but something is clearly going on considering that they look so young for how old they must be to have Billy as their child, and that there's no one in the hospital. Something weird's going on here.

SPEAKER_02 1:25:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:50

So those are my main theories. Also, I'm just really curious about again Rushville and the manhunter. I just can't wait to see what happens next. I'm pretty hooked. So, what'd you think, Sush?

SPEAKER_01 1:26:03

Well, for anyone who complained about there not being enough aliens or space stuff to do. Oh my god, eventually this episode shut them up. Uh I mean, I was sure that DC wouldn't try to get away with having a completely terrestrial story involving Green Lanterns when they're goddamn space cops. But you know, people had to be proven real. So I'm glad it happened in the second episode immediately. I had a blast seeing Hal's mansion and meeting his pet, the carnivorous plant earl, who he affectionately gave his last name.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:41

I know, so sweet.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:43

Yeah, the safe or container Hal's lantern was in, being a doorway to a pocket dimension, and also the password being Mogo doesn't socialize, uh, which happens to be a reference to the title of the first appearance story of Mogo, who is actually a sentient planet that's part of the Green Lantern core.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:04

Oh, cool. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:06

Both of those, I think, were nice touches. I also love the retrofuturistic look of the lantern when they finally reveal it. It was cool having John get captured by aliens, involved in this galactic war that's supposedly on its way to Earth, especially since there's rumors that those characters are or will eventually lead to the reveal of other lantern cores.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:30

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:31

Based on DC's emotional electromagnetic spectrum, if that sounds like nonsense to you, basically a green isn't the only color of lantern there is in DC comics. But the rumor seems at least a reasonable argument given to the showrunners decided to just title it lanterns instead of something specific to green lanterns. Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. Also, Anton mentioning manhunt. Hunters and providing some details surrounding them. I really feel like that's going to connect to William Macon and his militia somehow. I don't know if we're supposed to believe his benefactor has been one all along, or maybe he himself is the manhunter. All I know is one of those guesses is probably right, given how these aliens are appearing in places in town that William clearly has some kind of influence over.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:26

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:28

I like that Hal and Sheriff Kane are working together now, too. Definitely some amusing interactions between them during this episode. But even though they've seemingly agreed to play nicely as they try to work together on this investigation, I can't help but think that Carrie is still trying to cover for some secrets that the town is trying to keep. Uh especially with her giving what felt like a half-assed explanation why the hospital seems so unused. Also, I'm not sure if others caught this. They kind of made sure to bring it up in conversation between her and Hal. But Sheriff Kane is apparently from Gotham.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:06

Now I know others have pointed out that she shares the same last name as Batwoman, Kate Kane from the comics. But while I don't think that this character will connect directly to Batwoman or Batman in any way, I do feel like this very missable moment where she's he telling somebody over the phone to say hello to Barb for her.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:29:30

In the same episode, might be a reference to Barbara Gordon, the daughter of famous Batman ally, Commissioner Jim Gordon. She also happens to be Batgirl in most of her comic book and animated TV and movie iterations. So yeah, just looking forward to seeing if anything develops from that mention. The last part of the episode that I want to highlight, obviously, Hal taking off to a space prison to ask who else but Sinestro about manhunters. But even more crazy than that, was Sinestro implying that somehow John is a greater concern and potentially a threat. I don't know if he means to him or to Hal personally. I have no idea what it's supposed to mean, though. I don't think it's a surprise that we're being shown how capable John is as a Green Lantern, even without actually being in possession of a rain.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:24

Overall, I really like that we're connecting the show to more comic book lore, though.

SPEAKER_02 1:30:29

That's cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:30

For now, admittedly, a lot of the things I'm looking forward to might just end up being rumors that don't pan out.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:36

I know. I like the rumors and the theories.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:39

Yeah, I think a part of me does feel like it's a pretty big ask for the general HBO audience to buy into this rainbow space coalition of superhero beings powered by colored emotional rings uh after only, you know, live-action Green Lantern movie that was received so poorly by many.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:57

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:58

Um but I guess I should take into account how far we've gotten into space stuff over in the MCU. So hey, maybe general audiences or at least the subsection of general audiences that seems to enjoy and are able to make sense of the more comics-based detail that regular readers have gotten used to over the years, find characters and stories similar to those over in DC now in offerings like this. As somebody who grew up as a kid and teenager with pretty much only cartoons taking on comic book IPs, it's always amazing to see how much of a risk Hollywood studios have come to accept when adapting characters and or stories and lore from the comics. So yeah, really looking forward to what else comes from the show, mostly because I'm just interested in seeing how far they're willing to take it.

SPEAKER_04 1:31:52

Yeah. It's great hearing your perspective as a comic book fan because I'm coming in with basically no knowledge and I'm getting so much out of it. It's great that it's serving, I guess, both sides of the audience of people who watch DC stuff. So awesome.

What We're Watching Next

SPEAKER_04 1:32:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:15

What are we watching next?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:16

Oh my god. There's literally too many to choose from that that look interesting. Okay, we've got Buddy, we've got It Ends, The Dog Stars, Coyote versus Acme, Colony, Idiots, maybe even Legend of the White Dragon.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:31

Wow. Yeah, we're gonna have to look do a randomizer to figure out what we're gonna watch.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:37

I know, I can't decide.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:39

It's crazy. And TV is also kind of crazy because we're on season three's penultimate episode for Silo.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:46

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:47

And we're also moving on to the third episode of the first season of Lanterns. Man, today on Apple TV, Dark Matter is also coming back for its second season.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:59

Oh my god!

SPEAKER_01 1:33:00

Yeah, just too much stuff going on.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:02

Too much stuff!

SPEAKER_01 1:33:04

But as we mentioned before, we have a special announcement next week. We will be kicking off our next uh special month-long uh segment and celebration. Uh this time we'll be celebrating Statham Tember.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:24

Statham Tember.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:26

Yeah, month long celebration of uh Jason Statham, who yeah, uh we just uh reviewed his movie today, so good lead into Statham Timber, I suppose.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:39

Yay!

Outro

SPEAKER_04 1:33:41

Well, thanks so much for listening, guys. We really appreciate you taking the time to hang out with us.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:47

And uh make sure to subscribe, rate, and review. Positive. Like how Ashley was totally positive that no friend group made of women would ever put up with someone like I love Chris Show's character in Spa Weekend.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:01

She should be in jail for what she's done.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:04

Yeah, but other than that, make sure to follow us on social media. Vingenced, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Vingenced. Other than that, we'll check in next week.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:17

Bye guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:19

Yeah, thanks for tuning in.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:20

See ya.